tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-442909239199162925.post2433018679790182377..comments2024-02-29T11:45:01.870+01:00Comments on UK Armed Forces Commentary: The many weaknesses of STRIKE Gabrielehttp://www.blogger.com/profile/01623558391676151582noreply@blogger.comBlogger41125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-442909239199162925.post-23627198730810001732020-10-31T18:04:31.647+01:002020-10-31T18:04:31.647+01:00To me the better option for STRIKE would have been...To me the better option for STRIKE would have been a mixed Patria force Patria AMV XP doing the Boxer/Ajax role & Patria 6x6 the MRVP role. XP has already been integrated with a large number of weapon systems & I doubt the survivability/tactical mobility of MRVP I think both are amphibious to? If not at least 6x6 is. But hey ho we are where we are now 😐Simon mhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16125608946159074445noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-442909239199162925.post-7776448491797746452020-07-27T19:59:31.623+02:002020-07-27T19:59:31.623+02:00WELLDONE ANOTHER WELL PUT TOGETHER ARTICLE GAB
WELLDONE ANOTHER WELL PUT TOGETHER ARTICLE GAB <br />muhammad shahzaibhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11344123014620464965noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-442909239199162925.post-53108210066925014412020-06-07T09:51:48.857+02:002020-06-07T09:51:48.857+02:00Hi Paul, yes, definitely an upgrade on the Jackals...Hi Paul, yes, definitely an upgrade on the Jackals and a step in the right direction.<br />My desire to put an AI brigade in Poland is partly about positioning, partly about forcing AI to see what front-line countries are doing and exercising against it and partly about demonstrating to NATO and to the US that burden-sharing is taken seriously by us. <br /><br />The US apparently wants us to produce a warfighting division, I do not think we possess one for a Ukraine or Ukraine+ scenario, I also think that structuring the BA in order to fire Gaby's unitary bullet actually weakens the BA as a whole. In order to politely say no to the americans I think we need to be able to say 'a poorly equipped reserve brigade in poland is worth any number of poorly equipped divisions in Uk'.Corinnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-442909239199162925.post-5228328089048177702020-06-06T13:51:03.212+02:002020-06-06T13:51:03.212+02:00Operation Tractable moved a battle group with CR2 ...Operation Tractable moved a battle group with CR2 and Warrior to Estonia. Operation Cabrit is the persistent presence and British personnel will rotate on a continuous basis.PaulSergeanthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04668398532455852427noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-442909239199162925.post-42182912351545862152020-05-30T11:10:31.553+02:002020-05-30T11:10:31.553+02:00Meant to add, I'm convinced of the value of th...Meant to add, I'm convinced of the value of the French model by Gaby's work on this site.Corinnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-442909239199162925.post-42455569499601601402020-05-30T11:03:51.973+02:002020-05-30T11:03:51.973+02:00The point Jed makes about positioning of AI is key...The point Jed makes about positioning of AI is key IMO. I think though that we should look to deploy an AI brigade to Poland under NATO command. That would allow us to move over time towards the French Au Contact model of two divisions of heavy, med and light brigades with their own CSS etc. Prizing the enduring out there over the single shot at home.<br /><br />Reluctantly I've accepted the view that Chally upgrade should be binned, along with Warrior WCSP, in order to buy 245 additional Boxer to take the turret and gun intended for Warrior. Ajax should return to AI brigades as partial compensation.<br /><br />No. 10/11 have insisted that if the British Army wants more money it has to show that it is capable of cutting failing programs in pursuit of a coherent plan.<br /><br />If Ch2 and progessively Warrior has to be withdrawn entirely to help fund new capability like VBAD, EW, SHORAD, battlefield radar, artillery and fires etc etc, then that is what needs to happen.<br /><br />We can get back into the tank game once we have the enablers to allow them to survive on the modern battlefield. We are miles from that now.Corinnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-442909239199162925.post-31723945753441267412020-05-29T00:06:33.818+02:002020-05-29T00:06:33.818+02:00Hi Jed
Dusk over here, going dark quickly, I may ...Hi Jed<br /><br />Dusk over here, going dark quickly, I may not be so bright. Gabriele has told well that the British Army niche (or niches) expertise and capability, is not tracked or wheeled armour but sealift and airlift particularly the Chinooks. Our mass however is in 3 Div armour but your comparison to Poland is that our mass is not worth the effort. So one of many options is to get rid of heavy and medium armour - no MBT, no IFV, no Boxer. Such changes take time and I come back to incremental changes. Use the heavy armour we have and maintain it for future use but develop it for future use. My simple development is to fund some turreted Boxers.PaulSergeanthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04668398532455852427noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-442909239199162925.post-63434059138796356732020-05-28T18:59:01.500+02:002020-05-28T18:59:01.500+02:00Hi Paul
I describe Armoured Infantry (Heavy Armou...Hi Paul<br /><br />I describe Armoured Infantry (Heavy Armour) as a niche capability as not all 220+ Challengers are scheduled to get the upgrade, and 700+ Warriors are reduced to 245. Given that Poland has over 1000 MBT and 3000 IFV (yes, I am aware that the vast majority are Soviet era and need replacing) so yes, under 200 MBT is IMHO a "niche capability" which is not worth effort / budget in generating and maintaining. Every formation is "under equipped" compared to the majority of NATO allies, whether that is the size of the battalion with respect to total number of soliders, to numbers of mortars or ATGWs. Lets not even start on the paucity of SHORAD and other air defence assets. With 82,000 personnel we could do better, or we could in fact build up our strength in more important "niches" which are not being well served by our allies.JedPChttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06090008973629372385noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-442909239199162925.post-5106565320083257572020-05-28T11:27:26.102+02:002020-05-28T11:27:26.102+02:00Jed
Two AI Brigades are 50% of the Army's sol...Jed<br /><br />Two AI Brigades are 50% of the Army's sole warfighting Division. If, as is sometimes suggested, the Division deploys with 2 AI Brigades and only 1 of the Strike Brigades then tracked armour is 67% or more if you count the Ajax Regiments. Calling this a very small niche capability is to dismiss the warfighting Division.<br /><br />The Army will reduce MBTs from 3 to 2 Regiments. I would fill those Regiments out to form 2 combined arms battle groups, not Brigades, and release some budget that I would put first into turreted Boxers. That will take time and I don't think it is realistic to lose the heavy armour in the next 5 or 10 years.<br /><br />The Army is short of budget but an overspend of 227 million for WCSP is described as affordable and the unstated addition cost of CR2 LEP+ above LEP requirements is approved for addition assessment. A complete U turn by the Army to abandon heavy armour looks unrealistic.PaulSergeanthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04668398532455852427noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-442909239199162925.post-51786600011003148702020-05-27T21:18:35.262+02:002020-05-27T21:18:35.262+02:00HI Again, apologies for delay in responding!
&quo...HI Again, apologies for delay in responding!<br /><br />"Why do you think it a good idea for the UK to give up heavy armour, when even much smaller countries with smaller ambitions and smaller budgets have backtracked on such decisions?"<br /><br />Ahh, well, lets put it this way. It might NOT be a GOOD idea, but for me it is an exercise in realism.<br /><br />What budget is required to upgrade 227 or less Challengers, and for a less than stellar upgrade to around 245 Warriors? These are not large fleets, they are not positioned where they are needed, they are not going to be used often (or at all) in less dire situations / deployments. So we could have a small number of exquisitely updated MBT, with no modern supports - no SHORAD / C-UAS, no modern fires capabilities, etc etc.....<br /><br />So if money grew on trees would I like to see two well equipped Strike Brigades alongside two well equipped Armoured Infantry brigades. Maybe.. still have questions about transporting / deploying that armour and getting it to the fight on time. <br /><br />That being said, I would be happy to see tracked heavy armour dropped as an capability - IF - a properly funded and equipped Strike Brigade capability was, as TD would have put it "hard as nails" - in effect a wheeled Armoured Infantry capability (Mechanized Infantry, call it what you like). <br /><br />I understand your point ref other NATO countries already being equipped to do the covering force role - but the Italian units are surely committed to the Southern flank, and the Poles may have lots of Rosomaks, but they also have a lot more tanks than the UK!<br /><br />In summary, I see your point, but I really think that spending a lot of money on a very small niche capability, however useful it might be in certain circumstance, does not meet the broader value for money test. Hope that makes sense!<br />JedPChttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06090008973629372385noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-442909239199162925.post-62555245509019927652020-05-27T00:24:14.707+02:002020-05-27T00:24:14.707+02:00Sorry about this slow response. Enabling division...Sorry about this slow response. Enabling divisional manoeuvre is mentioned regularly but I've not seen it really discussed. It just seems to come up as an excuse for the weaknesses of Strike Brigades that you amply describe. Strengthening of the Strike Brigades is required so they can dominate the battle space as Carter describes. Also, the extent of that battle space, not in km but in opposition strength, needs to be described.PaulSergeanthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04668398532455852427noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-442909239199162925.post-50479819434847932422020-05-26T15:59:14.127+02:002020-05-26T15:59:14.127+02:00I've just finished 4 or 5 paragraphs that were...I've just finished 4 or 5 paragraphs that were cleared when I pressed preview. In short, I'm trying to keep the CR2 & Warrior cake and eat the budget for mixed Boxer APC & IFV Battalions. 2 Regiments of CR2 LEP (no extra money for LEP+). Only enough WCSP (a Battalion, maybe less) to form the 2 CR2 Regiments into 2 battle groups.PaulSergeanthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04668398532455852427noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-442909239199162925.post-28150478464259967302020-05-25T00:13:57.268+02:002020-05-25T00:13:57.268+02:00That is curious indeed, but enabling divisional ma...That is curious indeed, but enabling divisional manoeuvre must have been first mentioned pretty soon afterwards. I do remember it has been one of the roles mentioned for the longest period of time. Gabrielehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01623558391676151582noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-442909239199162925.post-47840369950014689842020-05-25T00:12:35.550+02:002020-05-25T00:12:35.550+02:00Thanks, i'm glad that the effort is appreciate...Thanks, i'm glad that the effort is appreciated. Gabrielehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01623558391676151582noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-442909239199162925.post-82827169138899715062020-05-24T22:23:37.665+02:002020-05-24T22:23:37.665+02:00Another well put together article Gab. It seems yo...Another well put together article Gab. It seems you are getting some stick in some quarters for giving your opinion. Whatever side of the fence anyone sits on with this particular issue, I think we should all aplaud any interested parties that care enough to put lots of thought into these types of articles. You are one of those parties. The more discussion we have the more informed people are in general the better. Dialogue is always good.<br />Anyone with any sense can see you care with the amount of effort you put in.<br />I'm a combat veteran myself and appreciate all the defence blogs people put out in the UK. Defence is becoming more and more invisible to the majority in the UK, that can only be a bad thing.<br />Keep up the good work.L Joneshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15515400614815460141noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-442909239199162925.post-12751772154007090822020-05-24T19:56:26.964+02:002020-05-24T19:56:26.964+02:00The answers of General Carter to the Defence Commi...The answers of General Carter to the Defence Committee Jun 16 are, I think, worth bringing out. You have given the link but there are 101 questions with Q62 being the first one specifically about Strike. These are my extracts, my numbering, of Carter's answers.<br />1. being able to project land power in a self-deployable fashion over greater distances, up to, say, 2,000 km<br />2. be able to dominate a battle space that is increasingly larger and perhaps has more population on it, that is more complex and is also able to concentrate and disperse rapidly within that battle space<br />3. The capability is being built on a vehicle piece of equipment — Ajax<br />4. the idea is to test it to destruction and to experiment with it, in the same way we did with the mechanisation of force in the 1930s, so that we get the doctrine and the concept right at the forefront and so that we understand what the structure should look like<br />5. Each of these brigades will have two AJAX regiments and probably two mechanised infantry battalions as well<br />6. it is a much more capable platform than just simply a recce platform and therefore what we are now looking for is something that can fill a capability gap at the medium weight<br /><br />Notably absent is the concept of enabling divisional manoeuvre. Strike is able to dominate the battle space.<br />PaulSergeanthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04668398532455852427noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-442909239199162925.post-38703320352837456312020-05-24T18:12:35.080+02:002020-05-24T18:12:35.080+02:00It would have been nice to be warned before finish...It would have been nice to be warned before finishing this. Being told to go down from 12.000 words to 5.000 was a bit too much for me to stomach, admittedly. But it is the way they said i had to come up with new objections because these points are either "only tangentially relevant" or "already discussed ad infinitum" that made me walk away. It is not a discussion if i'm dictated what i can and cannot question. <br /><br />Thanks for reading, i'm very glad you appreciate my work. I'm curious now, though. Why do you think it a good idea for the UK to give up heavy armour, when even much smaller countries with smaller ambitions and smaller budgets have backtracked on such decisions? Arguably, if we look at it through a NATO prism, there are countries better positioned to deliver the Corps Covering role as well, at least equipment wise. I have all sorts of doubts on political committment and resilience of logistics, admittedly, but equipment-wise if i had to choose my Corps Covering Force i'd want the italian Medium Brigades with Centauro 2 and Freccia, for example. Or the polish brigades on Rosomaks, which are also way closer to the front. Gabrielehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01623558391676151582noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-442909239199162925.post-45486558113336626792020-05-24T01:20:25.023+02:002020-05-24T01:20:25.023+02:00Fantastic article, great response to Strike Prophe...Fantastic article, great response to Strike Prophet and well researched - although as Nick has published my articles at UKLandPower I understand the article length constraints- still, that’s why you have your own blog, right?<br /><br />I have to say, I am one of those who would bin the Armoured Infantry Brigades in order to pay for well resources and structured Strike Brigades. If they are engaged in NATO Article 5 contexts in Europe there are continental armies that can provide tanks a small other heavy tracked armour, and Strike can operate as part of multi-national division or Corps as the UK “contribution”. Other than that, I agree completely with your analysis and rebuttal of Strike Prophets points. Jedhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04517577481039528727noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-442909239199162925.post-76004857954052532020-05-23T20:14:12.214+02:002020-05-23T20:14:12.214+02:00Maybe, maybe no. AJAX made sense as long as the pl...Maybe, maybe no. AJAX made sense as long as the plan was for Armoured Brigades almost entirely riding on tracks. When they decided to move it into a very different kind of formation, it unsurprisingly started to look very out of place. Gabrielehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01623558391676151582noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-442909239199162925.post-14705577924015237502020-05-23T20:12:50.409+02:002020-05-23T20:12:50.409+02:00Not only Boxer is individually very expensive, but...Not only Boxer is individually very expensive, but it is simply undeniable that the money committed on the BOXER purchase could have been used to get CR2 LEP moving on all 227 tanks, plus fund WCSP as well. <br /><br />Or you could have binned WCSP altogether; kept ambulances and (most) command posts out of the picture and order BOXER, 245 of which with the 40mm guns already purchased for WCSP, to equip 6 to 8 battalions, each with a mix of IFV (with 40mm) and APC. <br /><br />The Army has decided not to. The question becomes why the current approach should be preferred over any of the two main alternatives i just listed. I would have very much preferred playing it safe. Gabrielehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01623558391676151582noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-442909239199162925.post-7222659226454002022020-05-23T20:07:00.344+02:002020-05-23T20:07:00.344+02:00Thanks!
I just want things to be discussed with h...Thanks! <br />I just want things to be discussed with honesty. It's no good insisting that the idea is awesome because expert people came up with it. It is still not a given that the idea is good, no matter the experience. <br /><br />Moreover, it is crtical to realize that, however good the idea might be, if there is no realistic way to afford the means to perform properly, it is still not going to be any good in practice. Gabrielehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01623558391676151582noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-442909239199162925.post-9122814562928673092020-05-23T20:02:22.141+02:002020-05-23T20:02:22.141+02:00From MikeW:
Hi Gaby
Very sorry that your articl...From MikeW: <br /><br />Hi Gaby<br /><br />Very sorry that your article wa not published on the UK Land Power site. I was looking forward to some really high-level discussion and debate.<br /><br />Someone on that site actually mentions that you actually “make some points that haven’t been made so far in the comments section.” And many of the points that you do raise do not seem adequately answered. As someone else points out: “If the detailed questions raised by (demonstrably well-intentioned) critics cannot easily be answered then the problem lies not with the questioner.”<br /><br />I just jotted down a couple of your points that do not seem to be answered . One concerns the fact “that STRIKE’s unpredictability almost completely ends as soon as a meaningful river is encountered. There is little to no ability to cross unless a suitable bridge is secured, and that takes away a lot of that unpredictability.” You mention the need for a wheeled version of Titan. Another point which is not satisfactorily answered is when you ask “How does infiltration happen, and how do dispersed groups of AJAX and BOXER achieve enough lethality to be “dilemmas”? How do they survive and fight, disperse and concentrate in the contested environment?” <br /><br />That is just two points. And yet the “the Army voices on that portal feel that the points raised by this article have already been “discussed ad infinitum”.<br /><br />Never mind, keep up the good, and often outstanding, work. Much of it, I’m sure, is filtering through and being recognizedAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-442909239199162925.post-47770644318879077372020-05-23T19:59:52.262+02:002020-05-23T19:59:52.262+02:00Very much look forwards to it. Glad you appreciate...Very much look forwards to it. Glad you appreciated this; i think these are all things that must be said and taken into consideration. Gabrielehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01623558391676151582noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-442909239199162925.post-52845117058011520712020-05-23T17:34:51.721+02:002020-05-23T17:34:51.721+02:00New article on mechanised infantry assault guns at...New article on mechanised infantry assault guns at https://uklandpower.com/2020/05/23/the-mechanised-infantry-assault-gun-an-analysis/ UK Land Power now establishing itself as a go to site for objective analysis, serious debate and contemporary professional insight on British Army.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-442909239199162925.post-74947365385629123922020-05-22T21:47:53.595+02:002020-05-22T21:47:53.595+02:00Good stuff mate, not a fan of what is going on. I ...Good stuff mate, not a fan of what is going on. I will submit a more in-depth comment later. <br /><br />BVAnonymousnoreply@blogger.com